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Gender roles

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Started by #406477 at 08,Aug,13 11:09
To some extent I think size can determine the gender role you take on when with another guy. Every guy I've had has been bigger than me which makes me feel like a female.



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By #131063 at 08,Aug,13 23:35
Both comments I find repugnant. Behaviors such as this - men wearing women's lingerie, especially - are an affront to masculinity. You guys put yourselves out there like this and it's no wonder that bis/gays are often reviled. But that is not my point, the revulsion by society is then extended to those same-gender-attracted men that have no affinity for what is often found in gaydom. The fallout falls squarely on those males that do not have these perspectives. You guys are a tiny fringe fetish minority, even far smaller than the gay minority...but by your actions we all are judged and often characterized. It is because of this affront that 8 years ago I divorced myself from the Gay Community. There is NO part of me that is 'woman'. I cannot be associated with a community that celebrates and defends this type of behavior, and indeed, often promotes it as 'Gay Culture'. I see myself and my male peers as masculine equals and dominant/submissive is not an option!
By #420420 at 09,Aug,13 06:16
Why does this matter so much, to you, that you post this 'hateful' comment? The 'Human Experience' is that we all feel different things,in our own ways.

Did someone sexually abuse you, to make you **** others, so much? What does it matter if some other guy, that you don't know, loves another man, and likes to feel the softness, and sensuality of women's underwear, or sleepwear? How does it affect you, if you don't even know the guy?

I don't think that most people (the voting public) really care if two women, or two men, choose to be in a committed relationship, as a 'couple'. The recent trends for same-sex marriage laws support the fact that most people don't seem to mind an 'alternative' kind of relationship.

Why do you seem to **** this group so much, when society seems to be supporting their rights, and their lifestyle??

Most men have a 'soft' and 'female' side, as most women have their own 'masculine' side, if they are raised in an emotionally 'Healthy' environment!

Times are changing, and the ways that are changing are leaving you behind, it seems.

I think that you need to look at your own feelings, and issues, before passing such a harsh judgement upon a large group of people that bid you no ill will.
--------------------------------------- added after 22 hours

WOW!! Your response was very well articulated, and your arguments, against some of my ‘socially accepted’ terms, and thoughts, maybe even’ ignorance’ to the subtle details, of the feelings, and maybe anxieties, and ‘bias’, that you might feel, was well formulated, an well asserted!
Complements to you, for offering such an all-inclusive, and point-by-point deconstruction of my hastily posted retort, thinking that you were saying something other than what you were asserting.
I apologize for any of my ‘stereotypical’-based comments that offended you. I didn’t mean to offend you, personally, but I reacted, badly, maybe too quickly, to what I had read so many times from some guy just bashing anyone different, whether they be gay, or transgender, or whatever!!
My **** is a transsexual, and there is a thin line, among the ‘average’ people’s thinking, between gender dysphoria, and homosexuality, and all the things that are not anyone’s business!!
I didn’t mean to offend you, and I totally misunderstood your post.
By #131063 at 11,Aug,13 00:38
My thanks for your addendum, and I am glad I did articulate myself well and that my reply was well received. I don't worry, however, about my opinions not being well received by some...it merely flushes them out and reveals exactly what I state. My words are not directed toward those that militantly disagee. I'm not aiming to 'save the gays' or change anyone's behavior - they have to come to that epiphany on their own - my point is to reach the newbie here, or cause the young man exploring his same-gender-affections to THINK, and to go in with eyes open and hopefully help them avoid someone getting their claws in them and steering them down the wrong path. I wish guys in the gay world would take a hard look around themselves. Some, I would hazard a guess, did not expect themselves to end up where they are now when they first contemplated their attractions. Some have been drawn into a world of fetishes; aberrant behavior; disappointment; regret and a lowering of self-esteem and are nowhere near the hopes and dreams they had of a 'buddy' in their youth. Dear Friend, people don't offend me, behaviors do...except when people defend behaviors that have no defense. ;-)




By #301038 at 09,Aug,13 06:47
Gender role? You mean active or giving and passive or receiving? It has nothing to do with gender, besides a lot of gay men are versatile and enjoy both.
By #303133 at 09,Aug,13 13:02
Peach, the entire "gender role" thing is an out-dated myth perpetuated by a narrow minded and ignorant society. The idea that a MAN must be aggressive/analytical/stoic in order to be MASCULINE and that a WOMAN must be passive/illogical/emotional to be FEMININE is complete nonsense. There is no such thing as a male side/female side. People are people, and a mentally/emotionally healthy individual is aware that anyone...male or female...is (and should be) capable of experiencing and expressing all aspects of the emotional and behavioral spectrum and that doing so, in no way, diminishes them. The implication of the original poster's comment is that, by feeling "like a female", he is somehow LESS than a MAN. Such a statement is an insult to women and to any man who knows that masculinity is not defined by his feelings or the size of his dick.
By #23212 at 10,Aug,13 06:21
Thank you again JW for a very thoughtful reply.

I'd like to think that one of the few places to use 'male side' or the 'female side' is in a hardware store getting plumbing supplies. (OK, sorry for injecting a bit of humour in this otherwise serious subject. )




By #131063 at 10,Aug,13 00:47
@JKSM87: responses in [[[ ]]] below, with an aside to the other posters: My comments, just for the record, had little to do with Masculine/Feminine Personalities (the latter not to be confused with EFFeminate behavior) and more to do with public cross-dressing/genderbending behavior. My comments were not an indictment of 'personality', but the actions by a few in which they seek to aggressively redefine the premise of same-gender-affection.
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Q)Why does this matter so much, to you, that you post this 'hateful' comment? The 'Human Experience' is that we all feel different things,in our own ways.

[[[My comment is not 'hateful' toward ~people~. It was merely a critique of certain behaviors. This is a huge problem many gays have. They immediately pull out the '**** card' when the behaviors of ~some~ are critiqued. This knee-jerk response doesn't just apply to cross-dressing/gender-bending, but is a reaction to a myriad of critiques of behavior such as barebacking, for example. But please, lets try to keep the focus on point.]]]

Q)Did someone sexually abuse you, to make you **** others, so much?

[[[Was never sexually ****.]]]

Q)What does it matter if some other guy, that you don't know, loves another man,

[[[As a 100% same-gender-attracted male, I have no problem with men loving men.]]]

Q)and likes to feel the softness, and sensuality of women's underwear, or sleepwear?

[[[You are talking apples and oranges. Cross-dressing/gender-bending has nothing to do with same-gender-affection. Cross-dressing/gender-bending is a behavior, not an orientation.]]]

Q)How does it affect you, if you don't even know the guy?

[[[When having cross-dressing/gender-bending thrust on the public, it affects how society reacts to a larger group of men or men, individually, when/if their same-gender-affections become known. It may not be expressed directly, but the repercussions are felt by many who don't see themselves as 'part of' the gay community. There exists this assumption that all men that are same-gender-attracted fall into the same category (GAY"; "F@G"; "Queer")and that we all like to prance and mince about and dress in women's clothing. We don't. Why is it that many gays will often deny this societal perception still strongly exists, but they are so quick to apply their own bias to one of their peers (ME) for simply critiquing behaviors that only apply to a fringe? The true problem arises from within the community, NOT from my critique.]]]

Q)I don't think that most people (the voting public) really care if two women, or two men, choose to be in a committed relationship, as a 'couple'.

[[[The views swing wildly on a scale. But that was not what my comments were about. My critique of behavior has nothing to do with voting, spousal, legal, beneficiary rights, hospital decisions, etc. My critique had nothing to do with 'relationships' (or these types of rights) and never did I suggest I wished to deny the availability of same. Indeed, you can argue that the right to offensive behavior exists, and I'll allow that as well. My point was that it offends me, and I believe it does the entire community damage - in both the short and long-term. But you do not care about those latter points.]]]

Q)The recent trends for same-sex marriage laws support the fact that most people don't seem to mind an 'alternative' kind of relationship.

[[[Again, apples and oranges. My comments had nothing to do with 'relationships', but only fringe fetish behavior that does NOT represent the majority of same-gender-attracted men. Once again, you prove the further point that gays have a hard time accepting critiques, and immediately brand any critique of behavior as '**** for people'.]]]

Q)Why do you seem to **** this group so much, when society seems to be supporting their rights, and their lifestyle??

[[[I will agree that society, in general, supports the rights for all...but that has nothing to do with my critique.]]]

Q)Most men have a 'soft' and 'female' side, as most women have their own 'masculine' side, if they are raised in an emotionally 'Healthy' environment!

[[[However, that expression of the soft (Feminine) side has nothing to do with cross-dressing and gender-bending, nor does it have to do with Dominant/Submissive sexual roles. Men that have artistic or musical traits that may represent feminine personality characteristics have little to do with deliberate affected behaviors. As I mentioned previously, there is a vast difference between a Feminine Personality and EFFeminate behavior. The two words are not synonymous, but many in gAydom get the two confused.]]]

Q)Times are changing, and the ways that are changing are leaving you behind, it seems.

[[[No, actually times are moving forward. There was a time where the screaming queens dominated the scene, but that time has past. There is a whole demographic of men outside the gay community that are displeased with how their affections have been represented (over the last few decades), and we're finally speaking up. Only about 40% of men identify as totally hetero; only about 10% identify as totally gay (and the 'fetish fringe' is an even smaller percentage within the latter). This leaves about 50% of men unrepresented by either, and we are asserting our place as the true majority!]]]

Q)I think that you need to look at your own feelings, and issues, before passing such a harsh judgement upon a large group of people that bid you no ill will.

[[[I was involved in the gay community for 28 years. After that, 8 years ago I discovered the G0y Movement. In the past 8 years, I have taken an even closer look at my previous involvement (and my former peers) in gaydom; yes, with an even more critical eye. I feel that my 'issues' are justified, and they represent a far larger demographic than the cross-dresser/gender-bender crowd. Therefore I will not apologize. There may be some truth to your point that these individuals bid me no ill will; however, the collective result, and the fallout dispersed by the collective effort to 'redefine' the same-gender-attracted community by the fringe few, and the militant defense of the fringe at the expense of the majority - I submit does result in a lot of ill will. Whether intended or not. Certainly individuals might feel they can explode out of the closet in a forum such as this, and this venue is what it is. My point is don't be surprised or offended when those behaviors are critiqued.]]]





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