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STOP NEONATAL GENITAL MUTILATION

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Started by #10886 at 29,Sep,13 18:14
As you can probably tell by my nickname, I am not in favor of baby butchering. What do you think?



Similar topics: 1.The law is a ass!   2.GENTIAL WARTS   3.mutilation, genital mutilation, circumcision all the same?   4.STOP POSTNATAL VOCABULARY MUTILATION   5.Genital beading  

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Comments:
By johnp at 31,Aug,14 22:02 other posts of johnp 
I say cut them all ....
By #303133 at 31,Aug,14 22:54
Have you been on vacation or something? This is the first time I've seen you post in quite a while.
By johnp at 01,Sep,14 02:16 other posts of johnp 
I've been around.. U must b slipping..
By #303133 at 01,Sep,14 02:17
You are just getting better at stalking me.
Like that creepy seanconnery guy...
By johnp at 02,Sep,14 02:19 other posts of johnp 
There's nothing to stalk!! I need to see more cock!!! Come on man share the love!!

By johnp at 03,Sep,14 01:48 other posts of johnp 
Even tho u won't admit it that Seanconnery dude actually gets to u!! I must admit he's the first ive seen to do so !!!!






By JeffinKS at 02,Sep,14 19:10 other posts of JeffinKS 
Surgery Technologist and R.N. Discuss Circumcision


"SOME OF THEM WOULD BE SCREAMING THEIR HEADS OFF TILL THEY ****" ~A surgical technologist, interviewed at the Denver protest last month. James Loewen filmed this woman's reaction when Dolores RN told her that American doctors began circumcision in the United States as a punishment for masturbation, unarguably the most bestial thing we've ever done to our babies. Why have our doctors inflicted this horror on our people, and why are they silent about the world medical community's condemnation? Are we a nation of savage **** or human beings? 


only registered users can see external links


By #303133 at 28,Aug,14 12:40
Baby butchering should only be done by trained professionals.
Otherwise, you ruin the most choice cuts of meat...
By #264686 at 30,Aug,14 00:43
Wow?

By #170523 at 30,Aug,14 02:05
Yes,..It is a not widely know but that is how we get veal,
By #303133 at 30,Aug,14 02:51
"I have been assured by a very knowing American of my acquaintance in London, that a young healthy ch*ld, well nursed, is, at a year old, a most delicious, nourishing, and wholesome food.." --J. Swift, A MODEST PROPOSAL

Obviously, THAT guy knew an excellent "baby butcher".
By #264686 at 31,Aug,14 01:16
? what - ch*ld murderer / cannibal? is that what you are saying?
By #303133 at 31,Aug,14 01:42
I'm not the one who brought up "baby butchering"...
--------------------------------------- added after 10 hours

Does it really matter if it is murder/cannibalism if the k*d still has his foreskin?
By #170523 at 31,Aug,14 03:25
I believe all JustWill did was respond to the initial question,
By #303133 at 31,Aug,14 04:57
I thought the guy was talking about REAL baby-back ribs...
By #467242 at 31,Aug,14 10:57
[deleted image]
By #303133 at 31,Aug,14 12:53
Thanks, but I can't take credit for it. Jonathan Swift wrote it way back in the 1700s.
Who made up your comment for you?
(Go ahead, search the internet for a response. I am sure that someone else has thought up something clever for you to use. We'll wait...)
By #467242 at 31,Aug,14 17:07
[deleted image]
By johnp at 31,Aug,14 22:00 other posts of johnp 
To funny ... I think ur actully getting to him








By #23212 at 31,Aug,14 04:58
Thank you, JustWill, for the reminder about this fun bit of English literature, and the humour this satirical essay provides for those of us able to understand.





By #202392 at 30,Aug,14 01:59
circumcision should be ****, i am cut and wish i wasnt


By soundsgreat87 at 29,Sep,13 22:36 other posts of soundsgreat87 
You'll have no argument from me there!

I honestly don't care about the cut vs. uncut debate *at all* anymore. You can do/think whatever the hell you want about dicks. All I care about is that people (ALL people, women included, for parts of the world where FGM is the norm as well) get the right to decide what to do with their own bodies.
By #264686 at 30,Aug,14 00:42
For some people, and I do not understand it, think its the same as cutting finger nails?

But I agree with you. You should decide for yourself if you want it done (male or female)!



By my_cute_dick at 28,Aug,14 12:34 other posts of my_cute_dick 
Mutilation is different from circumcision.


By #354861 at 30,Sep,13 06:33
Yeah, and while we're at it let's leave the umbilical cord attached too! It has to be cut too right? Please, it's a simple surgery, and no different than getting the cord cut. It serves no purpose, and isn't an essential part of the body. So sick of seeing this.
By #264686 at 28,Aug,14 03:23
CurveBall (so people know who the reply is too).


Wow!


I'm not tell you that....


when you posted that, you said enough about how you think.


I'm just posting wow - this person can use a keyboard?



By #264686 at 28,Aug,14 03:21
Circ is ok. That is if you decide "For yourself" to do it - to yourself!

you do not have the right to cut, or have cut, another person!


I thank that should be very easy to understand for anyone.


By Rob00 at 05,Oct,13 06:42 other posts of Rob00 
Hi foreskins4ever, I was butchered at birth,as I never had any choice,my one wish now is that I have my foreskin
I believe I would have had more sensual sexual feelings during my lifetime, and I have always said a foreskin looks just great.
This circumcision practice should be stopped...


By Raypark at 04,Oct,13 06:47 other posts of Raypark 
I'm circumcised, had my first **** circumcised as the "norm" reason, but not my last **** after hearing the tortured cries from my first **** in the hospital waiting room and being better educated on subject. Wish I was still intact and regret doing that to my first born!!!!


By #354961 at 03,Oct,13 11:11
Everyone have right to do with his body whatever he-she want it.

A few things bugs me here:

- no one is talking that when they cut foreskin off the anesthesia is not used since is to high risk of infection. Just think about the pain ... but seems to me it doesn't matter, a little boy will not remember anyway.

- at list 80 baby boys dies each year in US only because of that procedure. Can those deaths can be prevented?

- some obscure religious cult even these days here in US still do that as .... WTF I know what ... and the torturer suck the blo-od with his mouth. Just recently one baby-boy dies because of hepatitis. Can that be prevented?

Before the conclusion about "not again" or cut dick looks better just stop for the moment and think about that.


My opinion which dick looks better? I truly don't care when the owner is happy what he have.
By #328554 at 03,Oct,13 13:06
Perhaps a better number is this statistic, in the US an average of 117 infants die annually as a result of the procedure, that equates to one death in every 77 circumcisions.

It seems that a good proportion of parents elect to circumcise without any thought and perhaps under the thought that it's a risk-free surgery.
By #219002 at 04,Oct,13 03:19
the power of conformity is so strong, they decide to circumcise their kids before even learning what a foreskin is... the worst part is the "looks better arguemnt" one, uncut looks better and two, most vaginas arent pretty if you ask me but you dont see me advocating female circ.




By #328554 at 01,Oct,13 15:17
Hmm I've always been in the 'leave it intact' camp however I have read several papers recently that suggest circumcision does significantly reduce the transmission of HIV/AIDS. So I suspend my view on the subject until I've seen conclusive evidence to support the suggestion. However this is really only an issue in developing countries in my view. What is proven is that the foreskin serves a vital role in sex and its removal produces a significant reduction in sexual pleasure experienced. Now I know all you cut guys are going to disagree, but you're wrong. I would add that hardening of the corona is only found in cut men.
By JeffinKS at 01,Oct,13 20:16 other posts of JeffinKS 
circumcision does NOT significantly reduce the transmission of HIV/AIDS. all the study's have been shown to be flawed.
besides look at it this way.... the USA has one of the highest rates of infant circumcision... almost ALL males are circumcised but yet we also have one of the highest rates of HIV transmission. if circumcision truly reduced the transmission rates wouldn't the USA be the model with the LOWEST number of HIV cases?
By #328554 at 01,Oct,13 20:42
Erm your data seems to be out of date or just wrong!


The 2013 data I have regarding male circumcision in the US indicates it's currently running at around 55% circumcised at birth and so that's quite a stretch to suggest almost all males in the US are circumcised! Secondly the US is well down the league of infection based on the latest published 2011 figures and not a patch on the infection rates in the southern African states.


The latest study concentrates on two tribes in Africa that are geographically only a few kilometers apart. In one village infection is rife with almost all the adult population being infected. The neighboring village shares similar customs, etc but here infection rates are significantly lower (by approx 40%) and the only reason is that in this village all boys are circumcised. The theory is that HIV virus thrives under the foreskin. As I say it's still being examined but may aid the fight against HIV/AIDS in rural Africa.
By soundsgreat87 at 01,Oct,13 22:58 other posts of soundsgreat87 
55% might be being cut today, but when you look at the proportion of males -- adult or not -- the vast majority are cut, something like 80-90%. Even as recently as the late 1980s, the infantcirc rate was in the 80-90% range, and that rate continues in many (mostly white, rural) areas today.
By #328554 at 02,Oct,13 15:09
I'm afraid your figures are also out of kilter with the facts.

The highest rate of circumcision in the US in the 80's was 79%. This is the highest and so your 80% - 90% is somewhat exaggerated. The 90's show a downward trend with a peak of 63% circumcised again a significant difference to the figure you suggest. I do agree that the main socio-econmic group that continues the practice in the US are C & D categories and predominantly white. The figures are somewhat skewed by the increase in Hispanic bo ys/men who are not routinely cut. However if you follow the trend it seems to suggest that infant circumcision is very slowly dying out in America.
By soundsgreat87 at 03,Oct,13 02:12 other posts of soundsgreat87 
You're right about the infant circ rates, but those rates don't take into account guys who get cut after birth. Social pressure and misinformed doctors who overprescribe circumcision for medical non-issues easily push that number higher for overall circ rate.
By #328554 at 03,Oct,13 06:45
Really, I'm not sure that post adolescent circumcisions are that numerous? I will try and find some figures but would be happy to read any anecdotal evidence.
By soundsgreat87 at 03,Oct,13 23:19 other posts of soundsgreat87 
Sadly there doesn't seem to be much real data on the rate of circumcisions performed after birth, at least none that I've been able to find. I have seen surveys of adult circumcision status, though, and they do seem quite a bit higher than the infant circ rate would suggest.

If you're looking for anecdotal evidence... I've only played around with about ten guys, all but one of whom were cut. However, two of those nine cut guys weren't cut at birth but rather as kids. Surprising!





By bigone21 at 02,Oct,13 23:32 other posts of bigone21 
@ good-guy:

Oh my god! This infamous study showing up again! And it is NOT the latest study, it's a 10 year old urban myth or hoax!

Question: When was the last time you made a serious decision about what to do and how to live your life, based on some trivial study on two tribes in Africa?

And what IF this stupid study was right? Get cut so you youngsters can fuck without a condom? HIV would NOT knock on your door if you are cut?

The message should be: have protected sex, use a condom! talk and think about how and when safe sex is in your interest!

HIV does NOT live under the foreskin, it's in the b l o o d and semen!

Protect yourself and be informed!
By #328554 at 03,Oct,13 06:41
Erm you may want to get your facts correct.

It's the latest study that I've read, I know the terms subjective but it is correct.

I never said I was considering circumcision based on the African study, merely stating that if correct it would be a valuable tool in the fight against HIV/AIDS in Africa and may make me reconsider the validity of circumcision. Of course you're right that safe sex is the answer but the reality is that in the African states condoms are still not widely used and so we need to offer alternative measures to reduce infection rates. I would add that the same statement applies to most third world countries.

I was being simplistic with my statement about HIV living under the foreskin but this forum isn't the place to give a full account of the the hows and whys, especially as we are not 100% sure of the answer. In very simple terms it's the safe and normal bacteria living beneath the foreskin that seem to encourage/incubate/assist the viral growth/reproduction and without this assistance the virus is much less active and hence you get lower infection rates.

I have never advocated circumcision in the western world and so I'm not sure quite where your safe sex rant came from?

I would suggest that prior to posting on these sort of topics that you a, read the thread properly and b, do a little research.
By bigone21 at 03,Oct,13 16:59 other posts of bigone21 
@ good-guy:

I'm not uninformed. I just don't believe every outcome of every study. I'm sceptical if I read stuff that I don't believe.

And thank god, there are more critical minds!

Have a look at circumcisionDOTorg/hiv.htm

Some points you can read there are:

"Even if the claim were true, based on the rate of infection in the studies, about 60 men had be circumcised to prevent one HIV infection. The other 59 men did not receive any benefit."

"Most HIV infections in Africa are transmitted by contaminated injections and surgical procedures."

"Among developed countries, the United States has the highest circumcision rate and the highest rate of heterosexually transmitted HIV. Other countries have lower rates of HIV infection than the United States and do not practice circumcision."

"Other studies show that condoms are better than 99% effective. That's why the American Medical Association states that "behavioral factors are far more important risk factors for acquisition of HIV and other sexually transmissible diseases than circumcision status."

"The cost of one circumcision in Africa can pay for 3000 condoms. Unlike circumcision, condoms also have the advantage of also protecting women, and there are no surgical risks and complications."

For you to read it properly, do a little research, and do some thinking!

And for as far as my supposed "rant" (your words) about safe-sex: If you think circumcision on every male in the third world is an intelligent way to diminsh the spread of HIV, I think condoms are a much more (cost-)effective method.
By #328554 at 03,Oct,13 21:08
Okay, lets work thru this logically.

The example I gave is fact, the only difference between the two villages is circumcision and so there are definite grounds for further study. I would dispute the figures you seem to be quoting as it is significantly different from my understanding.

Most HIV infections are spread by contaminated injections and surgery, highly doubtful and I would question how this conclusion is drawn? I think it illogical to think that far more people are shooting up or undergoing surgery than having sex by any measure.

No conclusion can be accurately drawn between the higher rate of circumcision in the US and the higher incidence of HIV, i.e. that circumcision has no affect on infection rates.(I haven't verified this information and so I'll work under the premise that's it's accurate.) Even if this were so it has no bearing on the African example / study. There are many factors both culturally and socially, including wealth etc. that skew the outcome.

I agree that condoms are life savers but it is only one strand to the prevention of HIV transmission. I'm suggesting that consensual circumcision MAY offer another. I think you must remember that there's still a lot of ambivalence to condom use in much of Africa and condoms are not always available. Condoms are also often misused and it's not uncommon for them to be re-used all of which negate their protection.

I am not and never have advocated using circumcision as a universal cure for the spread of HIV in Africa or anywhere else and you will not receive any argument from me regarding the necessity for condoms and safe-sexual practice. I fear we have moved too far off topic and so perhaps this agreement should be a suitable end.
By bigone21 at 03,Oct,13 22:27 other posts of bigone21 
If you could just tell us where to find this study, that might strengthen your case.

Just saying: "The example I gave is fact" is NOT strong evidence of your case.

If you agree that condoms are life-savers (99%!!), why would you want to focus on trivial studies about circumcision that cost too much and are NOT effective 59 out of 60 times?

And sure, this would be a suitable end.









By #419426 at 03,Oct,13 02:44
Stop...it's been done for thousands of years. I like my clipped cock, I like how it looks.
By #6568 at 03,Oct,13 10:17
Well I'm genuinely happy for your adult liking or your circ'd penis....but that has nothing to do with the subject or title of this topic, which is actually about the mutilation of tiny infants for no reason whatsoever other than the payment of doctors and a viscious predilection by society/religion to take away as much of a mans sensuality as possible......


........The "thousands of years" bit is irrelevant....lots of mans most bestial pursuits go back thousands of years but that does not make murder, greed, avarice, bigotry and cowardice, and the urge to injure other men (among many others) good things.....We can ALL hope for a better, more informed and civilised society

By bigone21 at 03,Oct,13 22:32 other posts of bigone21 
Have a look, just have a look!

youtubeDOTcom/watch?v=U5kaEEckXmU

replace DOT by a dot: .



By bigone21 at 30,Sep,13 18:18 other posts of bigone21 
@ JohnS:

Cut man that ask: why the fuck was that done to me? Is that nonsense or is that a legitimate question?

If you think this is a nonsense-subject, why do you keep resisting? Why not give in, and say, yes, every man should decide for himself when he is an adult!

The "circ-brigade" might think it's a nonsense-subject, but, knife in hand, they keep on cutting-up boys! And some of those boys will ask questions, or be mad, later in life!

The "anti-circ-brigade" can ONLY use their voice (and vote) to stop this mutilation. And that is what they do! And thаt is why it's a subject so many times in forums like this.

I'm wondering why some cut guys react so defensive on this subject. This subject is NOT brought-up, because the heart of the discussion is: what about cut cocks with no foreskin... The heart of the discussion is: We shouldn't do this to our b o y s, we know better now, this should STOP!

And last, but NOT least: If you think discussing the foreskin is nonsense, how would you know?? With you, it's like discussing eye-sight with a blind man! And foreskin, like eyesight is FUN and an essential function!
By #303133 at 01,Oct,13 16:23
I am disappointed.
You forgot to mention African witch doctors with rusty razors this time.
Your histrionic diatribes are less compelling without the witch doctors...
By bigone21 at 01,Oct,13 22:03 other posts of bigone21 
@ JustWill:

Don't lie to this forum: you're NOT disappointed in me!

What I think you want to do is to "frame" me as some idiot, getting into this discussion with "idiot" arguments.

But I am not doing that.

The problem is not in Africa, or the religious reasons for circumcising babyboys, that's the second step. The first step is to stop circumcission in the WESTERN world! All information available to EVERYONE, and still going on with it!

And there is NO reason to circumcise every boy. 95% of Euroean men walk around uncut, without any problem!

Give the doctor a knife, and tell him to look for a way to earn a salary with it, and he will find it!

Foreskin has a function, and if you cut-guys/circ brigade could START to say, there MIGHT be a point to that, that the penis was NOT invented with a foreskin BY MISTAKE, we could talk about it. Until that, we'll just keep on bouncing.
By #303133 at 01,Oct,13 22:35
You hurt my feelings!
I have NEVER had to try to frame you as an "idiot". The Africans with rusty knives comment is taken from what YOU said on a similar thread a while back.
Also (I know this is a language thing...like your use of the word "odour" in the "cleanup" thread), the penis was NOT "invented". INVENTED implies that it was created by humans. Like the LIGHT BULB or the RUSTY AFRICAN RAZOR.
I believe that the foreskin was actually CREATED. Probably by African witch doctors who needed some use for those rusty razors...
Perhaps, the TRUE function of the foreskin is to give some people a reason to dramatically whine on forums such as this.
By bigone21 at 02,Oct,13 15:56 other posts of bigone21 
If so, who is whining? Me, you, or the both of us?
By #303133 at 03,Oct,13 17:40
I do not whine. I MOCK.
By bigone21 at 03,Oct,13 18:21 other posts of bigone21 
yeah. that's the thing you do...
By #303133 at 03,Oct,13 19:02
Everyone needs a hobby!
By bigone21 at 03,Oct,13 22:05 other posts of bigone21 
well, it's illuminating to know you are in these discussions just to mock, because that is your hobby!










By Dalecash at 30,Sep,13 11:28 other posts of Dalecash 
Here we go again .....
By bella! at 30,Sep,13 17:15 other posts of bella! 
Can I hear an AMEN!!!?
By #187007 at 01,Oct,13 12:21
AMEN!!!!!!




By Odin_york_pa at 30,Sep,13 15:17 other posts of Odin_york_pa 
[deleted image]

Do you believe in spaying or neutering your pets? If so, what's the difference? They have no say whatsoever.....
By johnp at 30,Sep,13 16:56 other posts of johnp 
All responsible pet owners should spay or neuter their pets!

By #6568 at 30,Sep,13 17:12
Er,...pets are like 'animals'.....not human at all really, although I've known a few dogs who put humans to shame.....
By Odin_york_pa at 01,Oct,13 02:58 other posts of Odin_york_pa 
my only gripe is those that say baby boys have no say, well either does an animal. Human or not, they have no say...right? So on those grounds alone one who is for cutting a dogs balls off have no right to say you can't cut a little skin from a newborn.
By soundsgreat87 at 01,Oct,13 05:30 other posts of soundsgreat87 
Uh, you're forgetting something: babies turn into adult humans. **** do not.
--------------------------------------- added after 11 seconds

D o g s wow.



By #6568 at 01,Oct,13 07:20
OK...I'll bite;.....

Firstly, domestic **** are NOT HUMAN BEINGS, and secondly neutering serves an actual, tangible and reasonable set of PURPOSES........

.........Unlike circ'ing a newborn baby, which serves absolutely NO PURPOSE other than extra dosh for the doctor and supposedly a 'good' feeling for the parents who can be sure that they have removed a large part of their little mans sensuality for ever......



By #68656 at 30,Sep,13 08:44
Why does this nonsense have to raised yet again, is it relevant to our daily living.?
Is a cut male less masculine than an uncut male.??
Not only are we sick and tired of this nonsense the same old flawed views and opinions are aired every time.
By #6568 at 30,Sep,13 10:12
...Why dose this nonsense have to be raised again?....


Probably becasuse a lot of people feel very strongly about it.


Probably because it's a disgusting and brutal thing to assault a baby boy with this medieval (& ignorant) practice in the 21st century.


Probably because male sexuality is deeply damaged by it continuing.


Pobably becasue so called 'civilised' societies should be making child sexual-mutilation illegal.


Probably because for every happy circ'd man there are two more harbouring lingering grievance about having been mutilated and robbed by those who were there to protect and love them when they could not protect themselves.

Probably because sites like this with topics such as this are key to ending this vile, bestial and inhuman practice....


"...is it relevant to our everyday living.."


Probably not to you John, but to millions of men yes it matter a a great deal.


Probably it matters to every unborn male baby who, when adult, will want to know WHY he was robbed of part of his birthright.


It uncoubtedly matters to millions of men who everyday feel mutilated, robbed and illtreated by a viscious world.


"....is a cut male any less masculine than an uncut male..."


Depends on how you define masculine,...if you mean does a "cut" male have the same range of sexual sensations and abilities as an entire male then, sadly, probably not becasue it was taken away from him when HE COULD NOT OBJECT OR DEFEND HIMSELF AND BEFORE HE COULD UNDERSTAND AND CHOOSE.
By bigone21 at 30,Sep,13 18:17 other posts of bigone21 
I agree with it ALL!


By #10886 at 30,Sep,13 11:23
John....What's this we shit, white man?

Obviously a lot of people care about the subject, especially those who have children or are planning on having them. I'm sure that if they started to circumcise dogs, you would have an opinion, other than just whining about the subject coming up more than once.
By bigone21 at 30,Sep,13 18:17 other posts of bigone21 


By bigone21 at 30,Sep,13 18:15 other posts of bigone21 
@ JohnS:

Cut man that ask: why the fuck was that done to me? Is that nonsense or is that a legitimate question?

If you think this is a nonsense-subject, why do you keep resisting? Why not give in, and say, yes, every man should decide for himself when he is an adult!

The "circ-brigade" might think it's a nonsense-subject, but, knife in hand, they keep on cutting-up boys! And some of those boys will ask questions, or be mad, later in life!

The "anti-circ-brigade" can ONLY use their voice (and vote) to stop this mutilation. And that is what they do! And thаt is why it's a subject so many times in forums like this.

I'm wondering why some cut guys react so defensive on this subject. This subject is NOT brought-up, because the heart of the discussion is: what about cut cocks with no foreskin... The heart of the discussion is: We shouldn't do this to our b o y s, we know better now, this should STOP!

And last, but NOT least: If you think discussing the foreskin is nonsense, how would you know?? With you, it's like discussing eye-sight with a blind man! And foreskin, like eyesight is FUN and an essential function!



By #6568 at 30,Sep,13 07:17
I would defend anyones right to modify their own body in any way they choose, either circumsicion, labiaplasty or any other cosmetic proceedure.....

Equally, I would passionately defend the right of ALL tiny babies to be protected from this immoral assault on their inate physical personality....It's just WRONG to assault a child like this and make life changing damage FOR NO REASON other than a viscious desire to destroy part of that childs sensuality.

.....I'm not too hapy about the religions that do this either...not the caring and loving religions that they profess to be but intrusive attempts to CONTROL PEOPLE!

The facts are undeniable;.....removing the foreskin robs a child/man or two thirds of the voluptus producing nerve ends, and also prevents the normal mechanism of orgasm since circ'd men must get stimulation from their scar tissue to reach orgasm.....the foreskin is the organ that actually brings about orgasm whether it is undamaged or just traces left by circ. The glans plays little part in orgasm despite what many believe.


By #219002 at 30,Sep,13 02:28
agreed, im cut but wont be cutting my son if i have one.....

thank god theres foreskin restoration, but i still wish i could be born with my original parts. i dont talk to my mom for this very reason. she chose to have me circ for no medical reasons and refused to apologize because it's "normal" to be cut. i never knew people could be so damn stupid but now i know.





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