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In our country Healthcare is free.. What about your country?

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Started by Skeetersk at 23,Mar,20 03:32  other posts of Skeetersk
In our country Healthcare is free.. What about your country?



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By aoneeyedmonster at 05,Apr,20 10:05 other posts of aoneeyedmonster 
Nothing is free. You pay for it through higher taxes or a user pay system. Cuba used to boast about free health care and free education. Yet most of them live below the poverty line.
By huxley999 at 05,Apr,20 11:08 other posts of huxley999 
As Mark Twain said "lies, damned lies and statistics". You can get all sorts of figures for poverty.

The OECD definition means that the US is at number 4 for the poverty rates by Nation, and Cuba doesn't even make the top 10. It all depends what you mean by "the poverty line", I guess.

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By phart at 05,Apr,20 12:40 other posts of phart 
Well you get what you pay for. IF it is free, where are they cutting corners?
By huxley999 at 05,Apr,20 12:45 other posts of huxley999 
It's not free.
By Skeetersk at 07,Apr,20 08:19 other posts of Skeetersk 
Yeah. Some taxes are very high here. Like vehicle taxes






By Bratwurst at 23,Mar,20 06:27 other posts of Bratwurst 
In Germany it is free Thank God.
We must pay for insurance. But then the insurance takes all the Costs.
By bella! at 23,Mar,20 06:38 other posts of bella! 
So your insurance is NOT free if you must pay.

Is your insurance package tailored for you or does everyone have the same plan? Does everyone pay the same price? And you have absolutely no out of pocket expenses associated with hospital stays? Do you pay for monthly medications?
By Skeetersk at 23,Mar,20 10:32 other posts of Skeetersk 
Yeah. Germany is very caring about their people

By bigg at 03,Apr,20 17:52 other posts of bigg 
Health insurance in Germany costs a little over 13% deduction per month from income before tax, it´s not free. Additional private insurance for the rich means better care, but the "basic" is quite good. Believe me, I've lived in several countries....There´s a nominal charge for prescription medications, and als0 a nominal charge (I think it´s about 10 euros per day) for a hospital stay, health insurance covers the rest.
By bella! at 03,Apr,20 20:13 other posts of bella! 
Please expound on "Additional private insurance for the rich means better care", better care, how so?
By bigg at 07,Apr,20 06:25 other posts of bigg 
Faster access to treatment, better accommodation in a hospital stay, higher subventions from your insurance for rehab, dentistry etc.


By bella! at 04,Apr,20 07:55 other posts of bella! 
In Germany, there's also a church tax, what percentage of your income is allocated to church tax or is it a specific dollar amount?
By huxley999 at 04,Apr,20 14:55 other posts of huxley999 
I'd never come across Church Tax so did a bit of research:

German Taxpayers, whether Roman Catholic, Protestant or members of other tax-collecting communities, pay an amount equal to between 8% (in Bavaria and Baden-Württemberg) and 9% (in the rest of the country) of their income tax to the church or other community to which they belong.
For example, a single person earning €50,000 may pay an average income-tax of 20%, thus €10,000. The church tax is then an additional 8% (or 9%) of that €10,000 (€800 or €900) for a total of €10,800 or €10,900 in taxes.

As a confirmed atheist (and non-German) I guess I don't need to worry too much
By bigg at 04,Apr,20 16:27 other posts of bigg 
yep, it´s a little complicated but that´s how its assessed. They´ve got all it takes, to take all you´ve got
By bella! at 04,Apr,20 16:44 other posts of bella! 
bigg, to your knowledge, if you're working in Germany but your citizenship is elsewhere, is the tax structure the same for those people?

Also, I believe that the church tax is not mandatory. A person can opt out, yes? What happens if they do? My guess is that those who pay the tax don't receive a membership card like they would issue for Sam's Club, Costco, BJ's, etc. So........?????
By bigg at 07,Apr,20 06:37 other posts of bigg 
Good question, EU members are all taxed the same here as long as they are resident. Other nationalities: taxes are the same but health insurance, contributions to pensions etc may be different, don´t know.

Church tax is optional, anyone can opt out with a sworn affidavit. But don´t celebrate being rich: church tax is deducted from your income before tax assessment, so if you leave the church your contribution counts as extra taxable income for the state

I left the church, so can´t be buried in a church graveyard or married in a church service, not that I want either But I am a priest in the Church of Dudeism, no kidding only registered users can see external links



By bella! at 04,Apr,20 16:36 other posts of bella! 
So, please solve this equation, Hanz earns 50k, dollars, euros, or whatever currency is paid in Germany. His check is taxed 20% income tax, approximately 13% for the "free" healthcare and 8 to 9% church tax. How much does Hanz have left?


answer.) Not very much
By huxley999 at 05,Apr,20 06:47 other posts of huxley999 
If Hans earns 50,000 Euros. He will pay 6,500 medical insurance (13% of 50k) leaving him 43,500.

If he then gets taxed at 20% on that 43,500, he will pay 8,700 Income Tax.

9% of that 8,700 is a further 783 Euros, Church Tax.

50,000 minus 15,983 (6,500 plus 8,700 plus 783) gives him net income of 34,127.

I "think" that's right. And for that I am assuming (not being German) that pays for ALL services provided by the German Government, INCLUDING that chimeric "free" healthcare. Good deal?
By bella! at 05,Apr,20 08:05 other posts of bella! 
Hmmmm.....my answer would be different. My percentages are calculated from the total gross of 50k. 20% state income tax, 10k, 13% healthcare, 6.5k and 9% church tax, 4.5k. Based on my calculations, Hans total taxes are 21k leaving Hans a net income of only 29k, considerably less than your calculation.
By huxley999 at 05,Apr,20 08:16 other posts of huxley999 
I'm basing it on bigg's quote that;

"Health insurance in Germany costs a little over 13% deduction per month from income BEFORE tax"

AND the Church Tax is a percentage of Income Tax paid, NOT Income.

I may have it totally wrong, of course!

Added later!

Using this website:

only registered users can see external links

Gross salary of 50,000 Euros gives a net salary (after all deductions) of 34,474 Euros.
By bella! at 05,Apr,20 09:02 other posts of bella! 
Well, that handy dandy calculator clears it all up! Thank you and Hans thanks you, too! If I were his accountant, Hans would be living on 5k less.

By bella! at 05,Apr,20 09:09 other posts of bella! 
This site is so much more than looking at naughty bits, it is very educational. Yesterday I heard/learned about absinthe, today I realize that Hans is spelled with an "s" not "z" and free healthcare is not free!
By huxley999 at 05,Apr,20 09:56 other posts of huxley999 
I missed the absinthe thread. When it used to include wormwood I believe it used to be hallucinogenic, and many think that Van Gogh's troubled mind (to put it mildly!) may have been caused by his consumption of the Green Fairy! (la fee verte)


By bigg at 07,Apr,20 06:22 other posts of bigg 
That´s about right. Tax law here is complex, but (positively) health insurance, pension contributions etc are deducted before tax assessment of the rest, at about 30%. Commutes to work (I wish....) age, number of kids etc all play a part depending on Hans`plans
By Skeetersk at 07,Apr,20 08:17 other posts of Skeetersk 
Haha there are lot of knowledge here












By JizzyJay at 05,Apr,20 12:46 other posts of JizzyJay 
All I know is that I pay a buttload for insurance, and then I pay another buttload every time I see the doctor.
By phart at 05,Apr,20 15:59 other posts of phart 
well I had good insurance until the "hope and change" guy messed it up.Now it cost me alot more for the same things. Nothing can be done now. When this virus thing is over,the medical providers,insurance,and so on will be bankrupt or held together by the government.



By Chauncey_Street at 23,Mar,20 06:44 other posts of Chauncey_Street 
It depends. Some people get it for free, some people don't get it for free, and some people pay for it but they get a really good deal on their health coverage.

Emergency rooms in the USA-Open for all, by law. Even illegal immigrants can use them and get treated there, even if they have no health insurance and no money. Do they pay their bills once they get billed for the services given to them there? Do they? That's a question best answered by someone in the billing department in an American hospital.

Senior citizens/the aged old-There are some plans out there that are good plans that protect your hard-earned savings money. One is through a combination of Medicare and Blue Cross/Blue Shield. You pay up to a certain amount each year starting on January 1st (if you use something medical like if you go to Urgent Care or something-you pay the bills they send you up to a certain amount but it's a low amount you're obligated to pay) but it isn't a very big amount, then after that, the insurance company pays all the rest throughout the whole year...but it doesn't end there and it isn't quite that good and simple...then on top of that they take 200 dollars out of your check every month for that coverage but it is excellent coverage though...you run up a huge gigantic bill getting an operation, they cover it. You need home care and need nurses coming over to your house every day, they cover it. Etc.. Some senior citizens have a pension check coming in every month plus a social security check coming in every month too, so they can handle and cope with 200 dollars taken out of their check every month for that good, full coverage.

Younger working people...many, many different insurance companies to pick from...also Google so-called "Obamacare" and Gooogle the Affordable Care Act.
Remember, you'd want optical and dental coverage too, not just hospital and clinic visits covered.

The physically and mentally disabled on forms of social security that are different from senior citizens...they get free health care through Medicare and Medicade. I think they might have to pay small amounts out-of-pocket for their prescription drugs though, in some cases. But some pharmacies help with that and cut down the costs, some. Not all prescriptions are for drugs, some are for Vitamin D or Iron.

There was a type of insurance some were on called "COBRA" but I know nothing about it. A name like that sticks in your mind.

Am I wrong when I say I thought I heard Bernie Sanders wanted to give Medicare to all Americans and he'd get the money to fund that from taxing the billionaires and multi-millionaires?

Dental...some poor Americans get their dental work done at dental schools. Reminds me of poor people who get their hair cut at a beauty school to save money.

In some dental offices/clinics dentists and oral surgeons who accept Medicade are excellent, skilled, brilliant dentists, first class and top-notch, who do things right. In some clinics who accept Medicare or Medicade, there are dental hygienists who are pure utter shit and should be shut down, fired, and banned. So things greatly vary depending on who you go to.


And of course there's no such thing as "free"...the money has to come from somewhere.
--------------------------------------- added after 3 hours

I forgot to mention a free place people in the USA can get eyeglasses other than through Medicare and Medicade...it's through The Lion's Club. I know it's either The Eagle's Club or The Lion's club and I think it's The Lion's Club. People donate their eyeglasses there and you can go in there and go through the bin, trying on the glasses until you come across a pair that make you see perfectly. Well as far as I know, there is no charge for those glasses.
By Skeetersk at 23,Mar,20 10:30 other posts of Skeetersk 
Yeah... True. I'm Sri Lankan. Its still developing country. More people are bit poor. In here politicians are sucks. Some taxes are very high.for example, taxes on vehicles. But it's very helpful for our people. Sorry about my English

By Jafo1 at 04,Apr,20 15:05 other posts of Jafo1 
The Cobra plan was if you left your employer and wanted to keep your current insurance you had through them you could. The only problem with that is most employer sponsored insurance they pay a percentage of the cost of the plan. They also have a lot of members in that plan so they get a reduced rate. I left a job and wanted to keep the insurance I had. I was paying roughly 360 a month. To Cobra my plan it would have cost roughly 1500 a month.
By Chauncey_Street at 04,Apr,20 16:25 other posts of Chauncey_Street 
Very interesting, thank you.

By Chauncey_Street at 04,Apr,20 21:11 other posts of Chauncey_Street 
So if you wanted full coverage including optical and dental, WITHOUT Cobra it would have cost you around $1,500 dollars a month, out-of-pocket?




By Chauncey_Street at 04,Apr,20 21:04 other posts of Chauncey_Street 
And I'm not 100% sure on this but I think the USA has hospitals that only Native Americans (used to be called American Indians) can use. Maybe you have to have what I have heard referred to as a "blood card" you show and then you're allowed to get in, and the card proves you have Native American blood in you.


By kebmo at 04,Apr,20 20:01 other posts of kebmo 
As someone said, nothing is free. In Canada the healthcare is run by each province but it's all essentially the same thing. If I had a heart attack and needed to spend time in the hospital and have a heart transplant I would (probably) pay for the ambulance ride and any medications I need after I'm released. There would be no other costs for me to pay. Probably. Insurance companies through work pay for medication, dental, eyecare, massages etc.
Hospitals and doctors get paid by the provincial government. If I see a specialist, it's "free" but it has to be set up through my doctor. I choose who my family doctor is.
Hospitals are non profit so if I am sick I can go to any one.
Having said all that, I'm very thankful that I have never spent a night in the hospital since my birth. VERY thankful.

The big ticket items are taken care of through the higher taxes I pay as a Canadian but I can assure you I'd rather pay higher taxes and make sure that everyone in the country is covered by healthcare and no one has to sell their home because they have COVID-19 or some other medical emergency.


By nothuge at 04,Apr,20 15:48 other posts of nothuge 
Nothing is free.


By Chauncey_Street at 03,Apr,20 15:09 other posts of Chauncey_Street 
We (in the USA) also have VA hospitals which stand for Veterans Administration where the veterans can go to, but I don't know what kind of a reputation those have...if they are crap and dangerous or if they are good, or if it's a mix...some good, some bad. I wish some American veterans on this forum who have used them would tell us what they thought of them.
By phart at 03,Apr,20 15:11 other posts of phart 
I serviced a couple vending machines in a local VA in 1990 or so.I would not have taken my dog to that place.I got sick everytime I went there to do any work.
I have heard it was recently cleaned up and is in better shape. My uncle served in Nam and he goes to a regular doctor for better care.
By wycowboy at 03,Apr,20 20:16 other posts of wycowboy 
I'm a vet and go to my local VA hospital all the time. They take very good care of me but it is also in a more rural area of the country than a lot of the bigger ones. The big city VA hospitals are overwhelmed and care can be spotty.
By Chauncey_Street at 03,Apr,20 20:42 other posts of Chauncey_Street 
Thanks. And thank you for serving in the military.
If someone served in The National Guard or The Coast Guard are they also considered a veteran?

By Chauncey_Street at 03,Apr,20 20:44 other posts of Chauncey_Street 
Do you get a really good deal on visits to your VA hospital or are visits free by any chance?


By Chauncey_Street at 03,Apr,20 20:40 other posts of Chauncey_Street 
Thank you.
By wycowboy at 04,Apr,20 07:38 other posts of wycowboy 
National Guard and Coast Guard are vets too. Since I have a service connected disability all of my care is free. If I didn't have that my care would be vastly discounted, almost free but not quite, although, if the vet has medical insurance from work, for instance, he would not be charged for anything, his insurance would, and whatever that plan didn't cover would written off by the VA.
By Chauncey_Street at 04,Apr,20 13:15 other posts of Chauncey_Street 
Thank you. I was thinking Coast Guard people were probably considered vets but I wasn't sure about those in The National Guard. I'm glad they're all officially seen as being veterans so they all get the benefits that come with being vets. Sounds like you're well-covered in the way of insurance...I take it the idea of properly taking care of our vets and their medical needs was attempted to be made a reality and a continual one at that, but unfortunately some workers in some of the vet hospitals are incompetent trash and shouldn't be there at all. I think the trouble is people graduate from these damn cheesy "diploma mill" schools instead of nice, decent universities and they are not really qualified to be nurses but they are hired anyway. And not just at VA hospitals of course. Cheesy schools, cheesy clinics.
Oh, and a question for you...in order to get vet benefits when going to the hospital, do you HAVE to go to a VA hospital or can the benefits be applied to regular hospitals or clinics?
Here's a good example of crap that shouldn't exist in the first place...have a scroll-down if you care to, and read the reviews of Western Dental in Berkeley, California. An example of a place so bad it should be shut down.

only registered users can see external links






By huxley999 at 04,Apr,20 06:25 other posts of huxley999 
Healthcare is never "free". It's a question of how, as a society, you choose to meet the costs of providing healthcare.

This article explains some of the intricacies better than I can, but one quote from it that jumps out to me is:

"Healthcare is like education: everybody needs it, regardless of their budget, but it’s expensive. That’s why all advanced economies, except the United States, fund it through taxation."

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By dgraff at 23,Mar,20 04:45 other posts of dgraff 
Hell no in my country a weekend stay at the hospital cost me 12,000.00 then yet they put you on medication that cost me 258.00 a month so bottom line is they save your life only to run you in the poor house
By bella! at 23,Mar,20 06:32 other posts of bella! 
You are considered "average/middle working class" and yes, it probably feels like that to you. You have some choices in the matter, when you go, where you go, who you want as your doctor. So do you believe socialized medicine is the answer?
By dgraff at 23,Mar,20 07:07 other posts of dgraff 
No not really I don’t like doctors and hospitals period and I’m not so fond of government telling us what we can and cannot do either
By Skeetersk at 23,Mar,20 10:24 other posts of Skeetersk 
True





By bil47 at 23,Mar,20 10:21 other posts of bil47 
"Free" healthcare isn't actually free. It's paid for through higher taxes.
By Skeetersk at 23,Mar,20 10:22 other posts of Skeetersk 
Yeah... But in this situation its very helpful for our
citizens






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